Comments on: Dakar 2011: Smaller Bikes, but Still no American Victory (News) (Race Results) http://www.motorcycledaily.com/2011/01/dakar-2011-smaller-bikes-but-still-no-american-victory/ Motorcycle News, Editorials, Product Reviews and Bike Reviews Mon, 20 May 2013 11:07:28 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.2 By: Aspro http://www.motorcycledaily.com/2011/01/dakar-2011-smaller-bikes-but-still-no-american-victory/comment-page-1/#comment-14786 Aspro Sat, 22 Jan 2011 20:20:03 +0000 http://www.motorcycledaily.com/?p=12834#comment-14786 Two comments on this, and as I come to my 40th year of doing enduros, I think I can shed some light: The factory KTM 450's were redlining at 11,000 rpm...no wonder they were wearing out. In the races of the past in which the Honda XR's dominated, the redline was less than 7500rpm. This contributes to reliability. As for non Americans dominating, well, the pro's like Coma do six FIM multi-country rallies each year. If the US AMA could mount a similar season of racing, the I'm sure a top US rider would emerge. Why don't more Americans enter these FIM sanctioned events? Simple...$$$. The last Australian Safari that I completed was ten years ago. And that was on a 78 Maico 440 with a big tank. It was light as, and a dream with torque like a tractor. Never had to go over 5000rpm. I wish some 2 strokes would be seen in the Dakar, but the fuel consumption would work against them. If one reads Charlie Boormans book on the 2006 Dakar, he comments on bike weight and he says the 650's are still too heavy in the sand. He relates a story in which an amateur on a box stock 70's vintage Yamara XT500 came by him while he was struggling on a huge sandhill...helped him out and then quietly continued on, and with bugger-all support, completed the 06 Dakar. There are many untold stories of amateurs plodding away and their consistency gets them home. Two comments on this, and as I come to my 40th year of doing enduros, I think I can shed some light:
The factory KTM 450′s were redlining at 11,000 rpm…no wonder they were wearing out. In the races of the past in which the Honda XR’s dominated, the redline was less than 7500rpm. This contributes to reliability.
As for non Americans dominating, well, the pro’s like Coma do six FIM multi-country rallies each year. If the US AMA could mount a similar season of racing, the I’m sure a top US rider would emerge. Why don’t more Americans enter these FIM sanctioned events? Simple…$$$.
The last Australian Safari that I completed was ten years ago. And that was on a 78 Maico 440 with a big tank. It was light as, and a dream with torque like a tractor. Never had to go over 5000rpm. I wish some 2 strokes would be seen in the Dakar, but the fuel consumption would work against them.
If one reads Charlie Boormans book on the 2006 Dakar, he comments on bike weight and he says the 650′s are still too heavy in the sand. He relates a story in which an amateur on a box stock 70′s vintage Yamara XT500 came by him while he was struggling on a huge sandhill…helped him out and then quietly continued on, and with bugger-all support, completed the 06 Dakar. There are many untold stories of amateurs plodding away and their consistency gets them home.

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]]> By: MarkT http://www.motorcycledaily.com/2011/01/dakar-2011-smaller-bikes-but-still-no-american-victory/comment-page-1/#comment-14736 MarkT Sat, 22 Jan 2011 11:28:21 +0000 http://www.motorcycledaily.com/?p=12834#comment-14736 No Victory??? Maybe the Highball would do the trick? No Victory??? Maybe the Highball would do the trick?

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]]> By: Old town hick http://www.motorcycledaily.com/2011/01/dakar-2011-smaller-bikes-but-still-no-american-victory/comment-page-1/#comment-14546 Old town hick Thu, 20 Jan 2011 21:53:39 +0000 http://www.motorcycledaily.com/?p=12834#comment-14546 One last try. Please read carefully: "They can keep the 450s in the equation. Depending on the course, these machines probably have an edge. Including the bigger machines in the mix would make it all more fun to watch". And here's a news flash: Moto GP is going back to the bigger motors. One last try.

Please read carefully: “They can keep the 450s in the equation. Depending on the course, these machines probably have an edge. Including the bigger machines in the mix would make it all more fun to watch”.

And here’s a news flash: Moto GP is going back to the bigger motors.

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]]> By: Brian http://www.motorcycledaily.com/2011/01/dakar-2011-smaller-bikes-but-still-no-american-victory/comment-page-1/#comment-14543 Brian Thu, 20 Jan 2011 17:19:09 +0000 http://www.motorcycledaily.com/?p=12834#comment-14543 We need to get the AMA involved so they can change the rules in order to make the Harley Sportster competitive... We need to get the AMA involved so they can change the rules in order to make the Harley Sportster competitive…

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]]> By: Bob http://www.motorcycledaily.com/2011/01/dakar-2011-smaller-bikes-but-still-no-american-victory/comment-page-1/#comment-14494 Bob Thu, 20 Jan 2011 02:18:01 +0000 http://www.motorcycledaily.com/?p=12834#comment-14494 I've been following the Dakar for years. Last year, when the KTM 690s had to run with intake restrictors there was much moaning and groaning. On the other hand, as good as the KTM 690 single is, it took a very large and strong rider like Coma or Despres to fully exploit its potential in the dirt. Nice to see that Despres now has the party line down and loves his 450. Sadly, only KTM makes a single cylinder motorcycle engine with all the modern (expensive) bits and pieces and machining techniques. The street version, which only displaces 654 cc. offers up an honest 65 hp. Compare that to Honda's street legal 650 single, which generates 34 hp. Finally, you can get really excellent video of the event, for free at: http://www.sbs.com.au/dakar/ I’ve been following the Dakar for years. Last year, when the KTM 690s had to run with intake restrictors there was much moaning and groaning. On the other hand, as good as the KTM 690 single is, it took a very large and strong rider like Coma or Despres to fully exploit its potential in the dirt. Nice to see that Despres now has the party line down and loves his 450. Sadly, only KTM makes a single cylinder motorcycle engine with all the modern (expensive) bits and pieces and machining techniques. The street version, which only displaces 654 cc. offers up an honest 65 hp. Compare that to Honda’s street legal 650 single, which generates 34 hp. Finally, you can get really excellent video of the event, for free at: http://www.sbs.com.au/dakar/

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]]> By: E-Ticket http://www.motorcycledaily.com/2011/01/dakar-2011-smaller-bikes-but-still-no-american-victory/comment-page-1/#comment-14485 E-Ticket Thu, 20 Jan 2011 00:43:03 +0000 http://www.motorcycledaily.com/?p=12834#comment-14485 The change to 450cc bike for the pro/elite class (amateurs could still do larger bikes) was due to two reasons: 1) To break the stranglehold the KTM had on the race due to their being only manufacturer still making a serious big-bore rally bike, and 2) To level the playing field and encourage more manufacturers to field serious teams. And that part seems to be working. And yes, the 450cc engines may wear about a bit faster than the big-bore bikes. Why? Ummm... something about being *pinned* for 150-300 miles special tests may have something to do with that. Not to mention the 300-500 km liasons ... just to get to the start of the special (race) stage! The distances in the Dakar are just staggering. As for Coma and Despres, their nickname in this year's Dakar has been ... the "Aliens." As in, they are riding so much faster than anyone else - they must be from another planet. But that also speaks volumes about the huge Red Bull/KTM team effort behind them. While Jonah was rocking until his electrical issue that cost him over an hour, the BIG story of this Dakar has been Quinn Cody! Despite his Baja and desert racing prowess, he was essentially using the first week of the Dakar to learn how to use roadbook and GPS while racing. For him to get 9th overall ... on his first Dakar is just amazing. I just wish I could win Powerball. There would definitely be a "Team USA" for Jonah, Quinn, and myself ... floundering around in the back. But until then - Go Jonah, Go Quinn! Woo! What a great race! Cheers! E-Ticket The change to 450cc bike for the pro/elite class (amateurs could still do larger bikes) was due to two reasons: 1) To break the stranglehold the KTM had on the race due to their being only manufacturer still making a serious big-bore rally bike, and 2) To level the playing field and encourage more manufacturers to field serious teams. And that part seems to be working.

And yes, the 450cc engines may wear about a bit faster than the big-bore bikes. Why? Ummm… something about being *pinned* for 150-300 miles special tests may have something to do with that. Not to mention the 300-500 km liasons … just to get to the start of the special (race) stage! The distances in the Dakar are just staggering.

As for Coma and Despres, their nickname in this year’s Dakar has been … the “Aliens.” As in, they are riding so much faster than anyone else – they must be from another planet. But that also speaks volumes about the huge Red Bull/KTM team effort behind them.

While Jonah was rocking until his electrical issue that cost him over an hour, the BIG story of this Dakar has been Quinn Cody! Despite his Baja and desert racing prowess, he was essentially using the first week of the Dakar to learn how to use roadbook and GPS while racing. For him to get 9th overall … on his first Dakar is just amazing.

I just wish I could win Powerball. There would definitely be a “Team USA” for Jonah, Quinn, and myself … floundering around in the back. But until then – Go Jonah, Go Quinn! Woo! What a great race! Cheers! E-Ticket

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]]> By: Steve http://www.motorcycledaily.com/2011/01/dakar-2011-smaller-bikes-but-still-no-american-victory/comment-page-1/#comment-14477 Steve Wed, 19 Jan 2011 23:25:40 +0000 http://www.motorcycledaily.com/?p=12834#comment-14477 Dude, your post was 'bigger is butcher", "smaller is whimpy'. BTW, there are 2 Steves posting here ! But I've got to agree with the other Steve - anyone who thinks a bigger engine is more macho does seem to have a 'machismo-isssue'. Has MotoGP gone whimpy too ? Dude, your post was ‘bigger is butcher”, “smaller is whimpy’.

BTW, there are 2 Steves posting here ! But I’ve got to agree with the other Steve – anyone who thinks a bigger engine is more macho does seem to have a ‘machismo-isssue’.

Has MotoGP gone whimpy too ?

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]]> By: Steve http://www.motorcycledaily.com/2011/01/dakar-2011-smaller-bikes-but-still-no-american-victory/comment-page-1/#comment-14475 Steve Wed, 19 Jan 2011 23:19:32 +0000 http://www.motorcycledaily.com/?p=12834#comment-14475 It's certainly an irony that the richest country doesn't have a full team in the toughest rally. If that happens then I'm sure we'd see some US riders at least be in contention and that would make the race even more exciting. What's a sad indictment in your train of thought is that the US will only support US successes. I really hope that isn't true. I agree they should try to balance reliability, power and weight for more reliability and allow only one spare engine. They need a spare engine because some stages finish very late and the next starts very early. There's not enough time to strip and rebuild an engine, so it seems entirely reasonable to have a spare. However, having 2 spare engines does seem excessive. Anyway, I loved the coverage of this race and I'm already looking forward to the next one. It’s certainly an irony that the richest country doesn’t have a full team in the toughest rally.

If that happens then I’m sure we’d see some US riders at least be in contention and that would make the race even more exciting.

What’s a sad indictment in your train of thought is that the US will only support US successes. I really hope that isn’t true.

I agree they should try to balance reliability, power and weight for more reliability and allow only one spare engine. They need a spare engine because some stages finish very late and the next starts very early. There’s not enough time to strip and rebuild an engine, so it seems entirely reasonable to have a spare. However, having 2 spare engines does seem excessive.

Anyway, I loved the coverage of this race and I’m already looking forward to the next one.

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]]> By: Old town hick http://www.motorcycledaily.com/2011/01/dakar-2011-smaller-bikes-but-still-no-american-victory/comment-page-1/#comment-14372 Old town hick Wed, 19 Jan 2011 01:51:30 +0000 http://www.motorcycledaily.com/?p=12834#comment-14372 "Unless you’re an insecure male". Yup, that must be it. God, the maturity levels we enjoy on this blog! Steve, you might want to read and actually understand the meaning of the post. “Unless you’re an insecure male”. Yup, that must be it.

God, the maturity levels we enjoy on this blog! Steve, you might want to read and actually understand the meaning of the post.

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]]> By: Gabe http://www.motorcycledaily.com/2011/01/dakar-2011-smaller-bikes-but-still-no-american-victory/comment-page-1/#comment-14368 Gabe Wed, 19 Jan 2011 01:19:59 +0000 http://www.motorcycledaily.com/?p=12834#comment-14368 One thing I left out of the story is that Street and Cody are privateers. Street raised the money himself and did the event on a bare-bones budget. The KTM guys had deep pockets behind them. It's like dismissing a privateer who "only" finishes 9th in MotoGP. One thing I left out of the story is that Street and Cody are privateers. Street raised the money himself and did the event on a bare-bones budget. The KTM guys had deep pockets behind them. It’s like dismissing a privateer who “only” finishes 9th in MotoGP.

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