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Argentina MotoGP Results

Alex Rins (Suzuki) took his first podium today.

Cal Crutchlow (Honda) won a wild and woolly MotoGP race earlier today. Finishing second and third, respectively, were Johann Zarco (Yamaha) and Alex Rins (Suzuki), who took his first ever podium in MotoGP.

After Jack Miller (Ducati) was the only rider to choose slicks for the start of the race, other riders began to exit the grid to switch from wets to slicks, causing a delay in the start. When the race did start, Miller was placed on pole with the remaining grid starting several rows behind.

Miller led on the first lap but was quickly overtaken by Marc Marquez (Honda), who had a massive speed advantage over the remainder of the field. Marquez began to pull away, but then was forced to take a ride-through penalty (Marquez had bump-started his bike when it stalled on the grid, and should have started from pit lane, but instead rode back to his grid position, incurring the penalty). Marquez exited pit lane in 19th position, before proceeding to pick off rider-after-rider on his way to the front.

Out front, a battle ensued between Crutchlow, Zarco, Rins and Miller, but behind there was great drama as Marquez pushed toward the front like a bull in a china shop. Countless aggressive passes included blind attacks on Aleix Espargaró (Aprilia) and Valentino Rossi (Yamaha), who were nearly punted out of the way by Marquez diving into them in corners. Rossi went down from the impact with Marquez near the end of the race, falling from 6th position to 19th as he struggled to re-start his bike.

Provisionally, Marquez finished in 5th position, but was later assessed a 30 second penalty as a result of his impact with Rossi.  In the end, Marquez finished out of the points in 18th.

Crutchlow takes the points lead in the championship. Follow this link to full race results. For additional details and points, visit the official MotoGP site.


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136 Comments

  1. DB says:

    Been watching Moto GP for quite some time now, can’t ever remember seeing a race quite like this one. I am not familiar with the actual rule about stalling your bike on the grid, but is sounds like he should have started from the pit lane? If this is true, why did they start the race? Seems like they should have delayed the start, sent him to the pit lane, then started the race. I was pretty confused about the start as well, never saw empty grid spaces between the pole and the rest of the rider’s. With all the extra’s thrown in, I have to say it still was a pretty exciting race!

  2. Trpldog says:

    Other than the combination of Marc being swamped in thick Red Mist and his disrespecting old men in blue suits, it all went smooth as silk.

  3. mickey says:

    Reports are coming out that Pedrosa has a fractured right wrist and is scheduled for surgery.

    • Curly says:

      Bummer. Robbed of another shot at the title. Not that he was a favorite to win it this season but Dani is probably the best rider never to have won the GP championship.

    • Jeremy in TX says:

      Sad to hear it. That dude just can’t get a break.

    • xLaYN says:

      Surgery complete, evaluation on Saturday… still a question the race on Sunday.
      It’ll be interesting to see the COTA reaction to MM.

    • Provologna says:

      VR46 said MM’s striking VR46 was deliberate. Post race one of the all time nicest and most gentlemanly racers extant Andrea Dovisioso said, “MM did almost everything wrong.” Unless MM striking VR46 was good or neutral, AD’s statement includes MM striking VR46.

      Dorna penalized MM 30S post race. Ago says VR46’s complaint is “wrong.”

      If Ago is “right” as you claim, then MM did nothing wrong, Dorna’s penalty was wrong, and Honda should appeal the penalty. Readers get one guess why Honda has not appealed the penalty.

      Please correct any errors above.

      You, Ago, MM, and Honda: “Believe me, not your lying eyes!” hahahahahahahahah

  4. Vrooom says:

    It’s ironic how likely the most talented rider on the grid has no respect for other’s safety and the etiquette of MotoGP riding. He should be held out of several races, he cost Rossi a chance for the title very likely, he cost Espargo points and placement, he should pay a larger penalty than them. That may be the way he learns that tossing other riders to the ground is not how you pass. He honestly seemed to have matured somewhat, but through that away.

    • joe b says:

      I believe if you look at the replays, Rossi was 20 feet from the inside when Marquez came up the inside to pass. Watching in slow motion, Rossi pivoted and ran into the outside of Marquez, effectively either pushing against his left arm or left handlebar, causing Marques to tuck his front wheel, and stand his bike up, resulting in him then pushing Rossi towards the outside of the corner. If your reasoning would be believed, Rossi should be held out several reaces, so he learns that ramming others from behind is not how you try to pass. Maybe you should go back and watch the replays, sorry you didnt get to light off your yellow smoke bomb, and you can put your yellow wig back on now.

      • Provologna says:

        My post 2 up addresses this. In addition: every race announcer concluded the polar opposite of your analysis. VR’s inevitable and only line was the one he owned in front, which MM wrongly and willfully chose to intersect. Unanimously all announcers also stated MM was so much faster than everyone else that it heaps only further guilt onto MM.

        By your terminally flawed logic, Dorna wrongly penalized MM 30S and Honda should and would positively appeal if your claim was even half right, which it’s not.

        One guess why Honda has not appealed and shall not appeal.

      • Provologna says:

        Apology for double reply.

        Racer A leads racer B. Suppose Racer A’s speed dictates sum total one line through a given corner, only wide enough for one bike and rider.

        Racer B intersecting the above described arc through the turn is a clear rule violation. Why? Because such intersection by definition unreasonably increases the likelihood too high that A and/or B would crash.

        You appear to freeze in time a particular gap under VR46 which you claim was an “opening” for MM. MM taking that space requires both bikes to arrive at point X at the same time a fraction of second later, causing the crash as occurred in the race.

        The personal attacks/making fun of other posters with opposite opinion is a sure sign you lost the debate.

        Again, if your position is correct then Dorna’s 30S penalty on MM was incorrect, and Honda should appeal, which they won’t because the penalty was too mild and Honda actually deserves a greater penalty.

      • David S says:

        Well thats quite hilarious. Thats an alternative view for sure…..and thats coming from me who beat the heck out of Rossi on the MM Rossi debate in the past. MM was CLEARLY in the wrong……

  5. bmbktmracer says:

    Meanwhile… A big congratulations to the top 4 riders as they all rode brilliant races. Crutchlow, especially, was superb from start to finish. Plus, his post-race interviews are hilarious.

  6. Phil J says:

    Marquez knew he’d over stepped the mark. I’d like to see a transfer of a few championship points from MM to Rossi. A deterrent and penalty fitting the crime.
    Unsafe riding is a serious business. If perpetrators knew a conviction would cost them points and gift them to the aggrieved rider, I think the red mist might be diluted a bit.

  7. ducremus says:

    As a long time fan of MotoGP, it is so gratifying to finally see Rossi get what’s coming to him. As others have mentioned, he has been a dirty rider for years, punting Sete, cutting the corkscrew at Laguna Seca on Casey, and knocking Marc down a few years ago by hitting his brake lever with this knee while in close combat. So far Marc has avenged Casey by cutting the corkscrew at Laguna, and yesterday punting Rossi. Can’t wait to see what’s next! Rossi has been a diva on the track for years, and his comments after yesterdays race are a great example of his hypocrisy. Flossy the Whiner.

    • Anonymous says:

      Marquez’s actions in Argentina aren’t justifiable any more than Rossi’s in the past – both are wrong.

      • Burtg says:

        Both are wrong. I saw Superbikeplanet quoting Jesus: “He who is without sin, cast the first stone.” They posted video of the 2005 Rossi punting Sete incident. It’s a double standard. Everyone cheered Rossi as he went on to win the race without any penalty whatsoever. Rossi has made a ton of dirty moves over the years, but never gets penalized.
        Marc, however did deserve the penalty. His overall attitude all weekend was disrespectful to other riders and race direction. Somebody needs to discipline him.

        • Hot Dog says:

          Piss on your modern day witchcraft… Don’t give me your religious BS… I want to watch racing, not fictitious moments.

          • Burtg says:

            Read my post again. Superbikeplanet quoted Jesus. I thought it was funny and wanted to share. But you had to get ugly. Chill dog.

          • Jeremy in TX says:

            It was very funny.

          • TimC says:

            Nobody f–ks with the Jesus.

          • ROXX says:

            Someone needs to pull the all beef frank out of their bun and lighten up a bit.

          • James says:

            HE hears everything you said Hot Dog!
            I agree that Rossi made the same move on Sete and others many times when he was a wrong man. Live by the sword, die by the sword, Rossofumi.
            Where’s your wife and kids, by the way? You’re getting old to be mixing it up with these youngsters.

    • Provologna says:

      By your pathetic and flawed logic, it is only right that some other unrelated rider “A” should take out MM several times, for his actions, which you perceive are as wrong as VR46’s past antics.

      And some other latter rider “B” should take our rider A, etc. etc. etc.

      The “force” is weak with the MM sycophants on this one.

  8. VLJ says:

    mickey, you really need to stop comparing Zarco’s pass on Dani with what Marc did to Espargaro and, especially, Rossi.

    Not the same things at all.

    Dani left an opening, and Zarco took it. Dani didn’t think Zarco would take it, so he tipped it in…too late. In the Rossi incident, there was no opening. Rossi already occupied the space. Marc later tried to say that he lost the front and unintentionally slid into the space. Point being, he admitted it was entirely on him. He knew he took Rossi out. He said it wasn’t intentional, but he knew he was 100% at fault.

    Nothing of the sort occurred with the Zarco pass. None of the race announcers were up in arms over it. No one at Honda raised a stink about it. Dani didn’t bitch about it.

    It was the very definition of a “racing incident,” and a normal, hard pass.

    What Marc did was none of those things.

    • VLJ says:

      Once again…

      “Your comment is awaiting moderation.”

      Crap. With the change made that was alluded to by Dirck, I was hoping this issue was now a thing of the past.

    • mickey says:

      Look I know they are not exactly the same, but still an aggressive pass is an aggressive pass. Some work out, some don’t. If it has been Vinales or Dovisioso instead of Pedrosa, I’d be saying the exact same thing. This isn’t the first time Zarco had made aggressive passes and ran into people. I think he did it twice at Qatar, and did it last year too. I call that hard racing. These guys hit each other all the time. Some riders are more aggressive than others. You know that. Simoncelli was famous for it as well.

      Do you honestly think for one minute that Marquez saw Rossi and said to himself “well, I’m just going to knock Rossi out of there and go on through” ? (like no one would notice) or was it a case of “I think there’s enough room for me to squeeze underneath him” but ends up there wasn’t? You honestly think he rammed Rossi on purpose?

      I’m not making excuses for Marquez. He was on a rampage and people got hit and moved around, and Marquez got penalized for it. Rossi only went down because he hit wet grass. On some tracks Rossi might have stood it up, gone straight, and passed Marquez by cutting the corner (tell me that hasn’t happened before).

      Marquez got what he deserved. I’m sure he will get a tongue lashing as well, but if you expect these guys to race for millions of dollars at hundreds of miles an hour and not run into each other once in awhile, you’re dreaming.

      BTW I got the moderation thing I think twice, and posts just didn’t show up right away twice today.

      • Fred M. says:

        “Do you honestly think for one minute that Marquez saw Rossi and said to himself “well, I’m just going to knock Rossi out of there and go on through” ?”

        Yes.

        “or was it a case of “I think there’s enough room for me to squeeze underneath him” but ends up there wasn’t?”

        No.

        “You honestly think he rammed Rossi on purpose?”

        Yes.

        Marquez’s disdain for Rossi has been obvious over several seasons, including when he flagrantly interfered with Rossi in order to hand the MotoGP championship to Lorenzo.

        If that had been two amateurs on a track day organized by a local motorcycle shop, I could believe that it was an accident. But Marquez knew exactly what he was doing and that mid-corner contact would result.

      • VLJ says:

        mickey, what you’re failing to do here is make a proper distinction between a clean, hard pass (Zarco on Dani), the resultant contact of which was Dani’s fault because he leaned in to a space that he assumed would remain available but no longer was, vs what Marc did, which was to barge into an already-occupied space.

        Now, Marc says he didn’t mean to go there, that it only happened when his front end locked up and he slid into Rossi’s space, and there’s the question.

        Do you believe him?

        I don’t, not this time, not after seeing what he did to Vinales earlier in the weekend, and again to Espargaro during the race. Marc was simply going to go where Marc wanted to go, consequences be damned. This attitude was perfectly exemplified by his refusal to leave the track after stalling his bike, which only exacerbated his red-mist aggression during the race.

        He took the approach that he was the bowling ball, everyone else was the pins, and that was that.

        Now, what I don’t believe is that he specifically targeted Rossi there. Had that been Rins, Miller, Crutchlow or anyone else in his way there, he would have drilled them too, just as he drilled Espargaro.

        • mickey says:

          Well I just watched both incidents in frame by frame stop video. Same corner (# 13) same scenario actually. As they approached the turn, both Rossi and Pedrosa left what appeared to be an opening underneath. Both Zarco and Marquez headed into those openings. As the apex was approaching both Pedrosa and Rossi moved down to the apex narrowing the hole to be occupied by Zarco and Marquez to the point they would both ultimately occupy the same space. The difference was Pedrosa stood it up, went off line, and avoided contact, (but unfortunately his back wheel slid out causing him to highside). Rossi kept closing up the space (headed for the apex) until Marquez had no room and the two collided. I have screen grabs which prove the point, but can’t post them here.

          After seeing the frame by frame, I can’t blame Zarco or Marquez, too much really. There was a hole for both, which they both aimed for, and as Zarco admitted would run them wide if that line was taken..and it did.So probably a poor choice on their part. Can’t blame Rossi or Pedrosa either. With Pedrosa and Rossi coming in on a different line closing in on the apex, and closing off the wide line that Zarco and Marquez were on, it was inevitable that collisions would occur. All 4 came together at the X if you drew it out on paper.

          • Dave says:

            I don’t think Rossi anticipated Marquez being there because it was a highly irregular line. It’s also worth noting that when they made contact, there was still more room to the inside of Marquez, indicating that either he wasn’t able to hold the line he was aiming for, or he wasn’t aiming for the “line”.

          • VLJ says:

            The difference is that Pedrosa actually left a bike-wide opening, and Rossi didn’t. Marquez drove up into an already-occupied space. The only way he could anticipate Rossi not being there would be if Rossi inexplicably deviated from his line.

          • mickey says:

            Don’t take my word for it, judge for yourself..there was way more room below Rossi than there was below Pedrosa..and no there wasn’t any room below Marquez in the Rossi Marquez incident

            Stop at the 17 and 18 and 20 second marks for Zarco/Pedrosa.

            * Oh and look at the line Marquez is taking thru that corner at the 16 second mark with Miller leading..look familiar?

            And at the 59, 1:00, 1:01 and 1:02 marks for Rossi/Marquez

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_OMRAUJTo4

          • VLJ says:

            mickey, all the proof anyone requires is in the reactions and responses of those involved. Marquez admitted he screwed up. With Puig in tow he went to Rossi immediately after the race to apologize for his obvious error.

            There is no disputing this, just as there is no disputing that he and Puig don’t make that trek to the Yamaha garage unless they know to a certainty that they are in the wrong.

            Conversely, no one from the Honda camp is calling for Zarco’s scalp, because both sides know that Zarco did nothing wrong. Same thing, regarding the race announcers. They were all over Marc, and had no problem with Zarco.

            The differences are clear.

            Where I disagree with Rossi is in his characterization of Marquez targeting him specifically, despite all the evidence indicating that when it comes to drilling people, Marquez doesn’t play favorites. If you’re in his way, he’s going to drill you.

            It was nothing personal, Valentino. He would have drilled anyone there, not just you.

      • Provologna says:

        This is solely for other readers, not mickey, who I quote:

        “Do you honestly think for one minute that Marquez saw Rossi and said to himself ‘well, I’m just going to knock Rossi out of there and go on through’ ? (like no one would notice) or was it a case of “I think there’s enough room for me to squeeze underneath him” but ends up there wasn’t? You honestly think he rammed Rossi on purpose?”

        Yes to the first argument, no to the latter one.

        MM “stole” the line owned by VR in front. MM presumed VR would either clear the line (MM did not care if VR lived or died after that) or if there was contact, VR would lose said contact, which is exactly what occurred.

        If your latter argument was the case, then MM is extremely dumb and/or completely lacks space/time perception, which claim is about as pathetic as the rest of your argument. “Straw man,” much?

        MM did not specifically desire only to “ram” VR as you say, but that option was OK with MM if it happened. MM would have just as happily accepted VR vacating VR’s intended arc, and after that MM did not care whether VR lived or died. MM rightly presumed MM would “win” an accident if such occurred, which presumption was obviously correct.

    • joe b says:

      Rossi left the inside open for 20 feet to the inside line. Are you blind?

      • Provologna says:

        Actually, it’s possible for others with opposing opinions to have vision as good or better than yours. Another straw man in this debate.

        A 20 foot opening at point A does not preclude inevitable certain crash .2S later on the only arc through the corner at a particular velocity.

        The language and level of aggression of the MM sycophants on this subject is obvious, as are the straw man arguments, which are consistent with having lost the debate.

  9. arrowrod says:

    Read all of the Marc Marquez negativity. I watched the greatest race performance ever. All of the riders who blocked Marquez could see on their pit boards that he was coming like a freight train to a railroad crossing.
    Rossi pulled his famous “block move”.

    Does anybody have a problem with “race direction” letting the race begin, when one motorcycle has a dead engine (Marquez). What would you do? Every other venue I know of stops the race and puts the problem bike at the back.

    Pedrosa should be fired. Marquez needs a “enforcer”.

    • tomrichs says:

      Rossi “block move”, you mean having the lead into a corner and being used as a crutch to make the turn? Marquez could have waited to pass safely and placed much higher in the points.

    • Fred M. says:

      I’m sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but you’re wrong. Every other rider on the track doesn’t owe it to Marquez to move off of the racing line and onto damp (or even dry) track so that Marquez can pass after he’s penalized for ignoring race direction. If Marquez wants to pass, then he can move off of the racing line and go around them. It’s not their job to help some cheater score points. Part of being penalized is that you have to safely make your way through traffic to regain places.

      As far as Rossi goes, he was on the race line and in front of Marquez when Marquez tried to barge in where there wasn’t room. That’s what race direction, race commentators, former GP champions, and World Superbike champions Neil Hodgson and Colin Edwards, all of whom are more insightful than you, concluded.

      When Marquez F’d up and stalled his bike, the track official told him to go to the pit lane and start from there. He ignored him, bump-started his bike, rode the wrong way, did some bastardized version of a three point turn, and lined up on the grid — again, ignoring race directions orders that he start from pit lane.

      Marquez doesn’t need an “enforcer.” He needs a suspension before he injures another rider (or worse).

    • Vrooom says:

      The other two commenters have covered it pretty well. There is not an obligation to move off the racing line to give a competitor a clean pass mid-corner, and Marquez pushed Rossi all the way off the paved the surface, it wasn’t like he maintained the racing line. There should be additional penalties.

    • Provologna says:

      “Does anybody have a problem with “race direction” letting the race begin, when one motorcycle has a dead engine (Marquez). What would you do? Every other venue I know of stops the race and puts the problem bike at the back.”

      That does indeed appear to be the only proper course of action, and I can hardly believe the race Marshall did not do exactly that.

      That said, it was also wrong to delay the race start so everyone except for Miller could change tires. Miller should have started the race alone if needs be.

      Screw everyone on pit lane. If they all crashed there, too bad.

  10. Hot Dog says:

    The hounds thought I’d lost my mind as I was shouting at the TV. This race alone paid for the whole season. It’s hard to believe there are those too cheap to purchase the Video package.

    Can anyone tell me what is the handle on the throttle that extends to the brake lever? It looks like a “Bark Buster” but it had different looks on different bikes…?

  11. TF says:

    After watching MM ride cleanly in a couple close races with Dovi, I thought that maybe MM had finally grown out of his youthful lack of better judgement. I guess not. The guy’s a hazard and needs to be reeled in.

    The same can be said about Zarco to a lesser degree.

    It’s interesting as someone said, it was like MM just fell apart mentally after the grid incident and he lost the ability to think clearly and assess risk. Not a good state of mind to be in when you’re piloting a 250 hp projectile.

  12. Brinskee says:

    Look, all excuses of brakes locking up or water spots or anything else are null and void. At the end of the day the pass was unacceptable wet or dry. He clearly barged in on Rossi’s line and physically rammed him out. Unacceptable and he should face a ban, period.

    • mickey says:

      I’d agree with that, as long as everybody who makes an aggressive pass and knocks someone down is also banned.

      then we can watch the 10 or so riders that are left riding around trying to avoid each other.

      • Provologna says:

        Once, maybe twice…But your dear little girl faced prima donna MM has been making a living of it for multiple years now.

        • mickey says:

          LOL he’s not MY girl faced prima donna. Just another racer to me. I’m actually a Pedrosa fan (He’s one of the one’s that got knocked out of the race). I do believe in treating them all equally though.

      • Brian says:

        Problem is, in the case of the other riders, we’re generally not talking about multiple incidents during the same race.

  13. ROXX says:

    Marquez is a thug.
    I’ve seen aggressive riding, but three times shoving your bike in under people where there wasn’t even a space???
    Something needs to be done.

    Those points that Espargo and Rossi lost due to his actions will never be recouped and if this season is anything like the last couple, they will be needed down the stretch.

    What a punk!
    Just hope he doesn’t
    hurt somebody before this is over.

  14. mickey says:

    Honestly the race was a cluster F from the beginning.

    The rule book states any rider leaving the grid must start the race from pit lane. Unfortunately everyone except Jack Miller broke the rule, so technically all 23 riders except Miller had to start from pit lane.

    But that might be dangerous…

    So race direction decided to have all 23 riders start from the back of the grid., behind position 25. Unfortunately there weren’t enough grid positions to accomplish that, so they moved them up with Pedrosa who qualified 2nd starting on the 17th position and everyone one else in qualifying position behind him.

    This actually was a penalization for Miller who would have had a greater head start, had they actually followed their own rule book

    then Marquez stalled his bike, bump started his bike, rode the wrong way on the grid re-lined up, and in the process ignored the Marshall telling him to go to the pits

    then Zarco punted Pedrosa off the track and nearly to the hospital (the guy has fragile collarbones, he got lucky this time)

    then Marquez got the ride through penalty (for the starting grid shenanigans)

    then Marquez punted Espargaro off line (oops sorry bud hand wave)

    then Marquez gets the lose 1 position penalty (but by this time he passed another rider and was confused as to who he was supposed to let back through)

    then Marquez punts Rossi into the grass (oops sorry bud hand wave) thereby drawing the reckless rider 30 second penalty

    and finally the race was over ….. whew

    Crutchlow btw had a great post race interview where he chastised the media for not showing up because they were all off chasing down the factory Honda and Yamaha camps for comments about Marquez and Rossi

    You have to love this stuff. Soap opera MotoGP style

  15. Gary says:

    Unless he matures, this will end very badly. He will injure himself seriously, and is also quite capable of taking another rider(s) with him. Grow up, Marc.

    • Mark says:

      It hasn’t ended badly in four seasons, why would it start now. It has worked for him, he hasn’t gotten hurt and he is a multi-time champion.

      • dt 175 says:

        actuaries would say that the probability is high w/ marquez, see rainey/doohan/schwantz/fogarty…

  16. Tommy D says:

    I have Marquez’s autograph on my pit pass from the 2015 Indy race. Since that day I have been a MM fan. I cheer for MM and enjoy his youthful antics and amazing skill he has on that Honda. With that said I agree that Marc needs to be sanctioned and sit for the next race. He absolutely lost his mind this past Sunday. He was having a nervous breakdown out there. I wonder if he had too much caffeine, too much syrup on his pancakes or a hit on a crack pipe. It was really odd behavior.

  17. Mick says:

    Sounds like quite the train wreck. Can I ask why they didn’t impound the Honda? A fuel injected four cylinder dies on the grid. Then it goes super fast while conserving the notoriously fragile tires. All while coming from the notoriously underhanded Honda garage.

    • Brinskee says:

      Interesting path you’re taking here. What do you suspect Honda of doing to the bike. I’m quite curious.

    • Motoman says:

      Not sure what you think Honda could have done. Pretty sure the motors of the top teams (all teams???) are sealed at the beginning of the season with no further development allowed.

      • Pacer says:

        Aprilia, KTM, and Suzuki can develop/have concessions for their engines. This brings up a good question. Does Suzuki give up their concessions for Rin’s poduim?

        • mickey says:

          I think they have to have 3 podiums before having to give up concessions.

          • mickey says:

            Think this might be the rule unless they have changed it:

            Manufacturers can lose concessions, however, and a more formal system of point scoring has been introduced. With 3 points for a win, 2 for second and 1 for third, any manufacturer racking up a total of 6 concession points will lose the right to unlimited testing with immediate effect, and all concessions for the following season.

      • Mick says:

        They aren’t just motorcycles. They are also rolling electronics packages. The stall may have been an error swapping some software package. Maybe to one that he shouldn’t really have.

        Honda never liked the spec ECU and there has been a bit of buzz about how to work around it.

        Fuel injected zillion dollar engines don’t just stall for fun…unless they are self aware.

  18. Jeremy in TX says:

    I agree with Mickey – bizarre race.

    Marquez definitely lost his cool after the ride through, barging two riders off the track and costing Valentino a handful of points. I really like Marquez, but I think he got off relatively easy.

    It’s a shame he went full squid on that. His pace was far beyond anyone else on the track, and a top 5 or 6 finish would have been quite the accomplishment and would have been of little concern to someone with his talent.

    Another racer I really like, Zarco, also pulled a reckless move on Pedrosa. I thought race direction would penalise him for sure. I’ll have to rewatch it – maybe it wasn’t as overly aggressive as it looked from the race angle, but I doubt that.

    Good for Miller. I thought he would fall back to 8th or 9th place by the end of the race. He had a heck of a run. Rins also had an excellent race. Suzuki needed that. Finally, congrats to Crutchlow.

    Okay, now who do you guys think will take Lorenzo’s seat for 2019?

    • Fivespeed302 says:

      It’s already been blocked by Dorna.

      That race was crazy. I guess you could say that the incident with Rossi was payback for the “kick” a couple seasons ago. Márquez reminded me of his younger self, riding like a complete maniac, which Zarco has been known to imitate.

      As to any sanctions on Márquez, who knows. I agree with Mick, the bike should be inspected, if for anything just to bust Márquez’s balls for riding like an ass.

      • VLJ says:

        Except there was no “kick.” That excuse by Marc back then was total b.s.

        • Dave says:

          The video clearly shows Rossi repeatedly look at Marquez, run wide into him, lift his foot from his foot peg, then kick Maq’s handlebar, then proceed back to the racing line, while looking back at his handiwork. It was as blatant a take-down as could possibly be executed on a motorcycle.

          • Scott says:

            Here we go again.

          • mickey says:

            Whatever happened when they were close is apparently still up for debate depending who you like better. What isn’t up for debate is THAT was not a “racing incident”, deemed deliberate by Race Direction, an act so egregious, that Rossi was penalized for it to the extent it possibly cost him the World Championship that year.

          • VLJ says:

            Dave, it shows nothing of the sort. All it shows is Rossi raising his leg in an effort to protect himself. There is no kick at all.

          • Dave says:

            VLJ, that’s simply willful denial of reality. The video footage is conclusive and as mickey points out, the race jury agreed.

          • mickey says:

            all I was saying is that Race Direction didn’t view it as a racing incident, but rather a willful act perpetrated by Rossi.

            I can’t say for certain what happened when the two came together, whether it was a kick or leg raise for protection, what we can say for certainty is there is no excuse for that kind of behavior on a race track and race direction agreed.

          • VLJ says:

            Dave, Race Direction NEVER said Rossi kicked Marc’s bike, and every last video angle confirmed that he never kicked Marc’s bike.

            There were other issues at play there, to be sure, but Rossi kicking Marc’s bike was strictly a pantload fabrication made up by the Honda camp.

          • jon says:

            Doesn’t seem to be what this angle shows, unless i’ve got the wrong incident

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eW_PvMP6hn0

  19. Tunde says:

    Sete, CS27 and MB3 must laughing their arses off watching that MM/VR clash. Karma komedy gold.
    Saying that, MM93 deserves a one race penalty of starting from the back of the grid. COTA seems fair. I’d still wager he’ll win the championship. And as long as VR46 still rides, he’ll be booed relentlessly. And he won’t care.
    He’ll need a whole phalanx of carabineri at Mugello this year though.

  20. Delmartian says:

    All things considered, this was one of the more entertaining races in quite some time. Loved seeing 4 riders duke it out in front who you rarely see up there. If Marquez hadn’t stalled on the grid and been assessed the ride-through penalty, he would have ridden off the front with a 30-second lead making the race a bore. He was foolish to ride so aggressively afterwards, punting both Aleix Espargaró and Rossi, but I have to admire his intensity and determination. He was penalized appropriately all three times, and in the end gets zero points, so the MM haters really can’t complain about lax penalties. As stated in previous posts I’m a huge Rossi fan, and didn’t care much for Marquez, but after the 2017 season I have more respect for his abilities (and it helps that he can speak English much better now.) So yeah, he rode like a crazed fiend and caused my hero to crash, but it was a darn entertaining spectacle. (I even got my wife to watch the entire race with me, and it was a good one that kept her attention and should help to get her more interested in watching future races this season.) Looking forward to Austin COTA in two weeks.

  21. David Fisher says:

    At one time perhaps Marquez could be forgiven for some of his careless moves but not any more. He is reckless and a danger to other riders.

  22. VLJ says:

    The “your comment is awaiting moderation” pox afflicting the posting system here is well past its sell-by date. It’s impossible to maintain a coherent conversation on this forum.

    Whatever needs to be done, it’s time to get this thing fixed.

  23. VLJ says:

    The thing about the penalties here is that it’s all fine and dandy that Marc was penalized, and may be penalized further still, but those things won’t restore the points that he cost Rossi and Espargaro. In particular, Rossi almost certainly would have salvaged sixth place, and a very important ten points. Instead, he finished out of the points, as did Espargaro.

    Do you think ten points in this championship might come in handy down the road?

    I seem to recall Rossi being forced to start the most important race of the 2015 season from the back row, as a result of a penalty from Race Direction. With Marquez having committed three major infractions in one race today, in addition to the crap he pulled during practice, I can’t imagine Race Direction giving him any less of a penalty than they gave Rossi for this next round at CoTA.

    If Marc is allowed to race at all in Texas, he had better be forced to start from the last position of the grid, if not from pit row.

    • PatrickD says:

      Rossi accumulated penalty points throughout the 2015 season to end up at the rear of grid in valencia. A black-flag, ride thorugh or time penalty would’ve been appropriate for the Malaysian race actions.
      Marquez was out to lunch yesterday. I hope that race direction now feel empowered to act against recklessness. They could’ve made their point during Moto3 qualifying. Instead, we have riders being too big to punish, and there’s an obvious candidate for who has taken liberties with that style of collision/pass in the past and looked pleased with himself about it. he was the one with a bike in the grass yesterday.
      Yesterday went as far as it should, maybe beyond. It’s now time for race direction to start laying down the law. There should be a concensus amongst the riders and team that it’s going to go badly wronbg otherwise.

    • Dave says:

      While there’s nothing in the rules to accommodate it, I feel that Marquez could be justly penalized by tying his fortunes to those he wronged for 3 races. What if he weren’t allowed to more points than the lesser of Rossi or Espargaro for 2-3 races. ie. Maq wins, Epsargaro gets 7th = Maq is awarded 7th place points on his win.

      That’s what’s so unfair. There is no reparation for the rider who loses his points to the aggressor’s foul. He must pick up his wrecked bike and go home.

      • mickey says:

        Except until that person crosses the finish line there is no guarantee that is the position he “would have” finished in. Espargaro might have got 7th, then again he might have crashed, or his motor might have blown or he might have run out of gas…no guarantees and so many if’s in racing.

        Pedrosa was in second when he was pushed off line and crashed due to an aggressive pass by Zarco. Should they have given Pedrosa 20 points? There is no guarantee that Pedrosa would have finished 2nd, (he might have actually won, something he had done like 31 times in MotoGP, so that is a likelihood as well) but that’s the position he was in when his race was ruined.

        Racing at this level is full of a million little things that can decide a race. You can only make decisions on the “whats” and not on the “what ifs”.

        • Dave says:

          If you’re KO’d by another racer, they have decided all of your “what if’s”. That’s like letting someone off of responsibility for a traffic accident on the grounds that the victim “could’ve crashed” later in their trip.

          Awarding the victim points for the place they occupied doesn’t need to take those points from the person who ultimately crossed the line in that position. It isn’t fair to the downed racer to take the loss of points on the chin when it was the result of someone else’s actions.

          • mickey says:

            Dave there is simply no way of determining that?

            Like I said Pedrosa was knocked out while in 2nd place. Should he get 20 points?

          • Dave says:

            “Like I said Pedrosa was knocked out while in 2nd place. Should he get 20 points?”

            Yes, if the pass is ruled as unacceptably aggressive/dangerous, he should get the points, and in this case, at Zarco’s expense.

      • mickey says:

        what happens if the aggressor goes down as well?

  24. Peter Haris says:

    It’s true MM should be more respectful of the elderly. Also true that lost points.

  25. Scott says:

    Interesting comments so far. Anyone starting to change their opinion as to who was at fault in Malaysia a few years back?

  26. Provologna says:

    Just when I was starting to (almost) warm to MM, he runs one of the all time most rude and reckless races. He’s running at least 1S faster than anyone on the track. There is not one reason on earth for him to pass anyone with any danger, just wait for the right moment and pass in total safety. But no, MM instead rides like he owns the track, the series, and can edit the rules (written and spirit) in the middle of battle. “No class bum” is an extreme understatement. He’s a rude, ruthless POS.

    I’d start him at least 2 races back of the field, maybe 3 is the right number. IOW end his chances this year, let him and his team digest that, combined with a written warning that any perceived intentional rule violation within the next calendar year results in immediate removal from the track during the race and a one year suspension. When he returns if ever, any similar reckless passing attempt is also followed by a one year suspension minimum and potential permanent banishment.

    Even MM’s race start was a big effU to the race Marshall. MM stalls before the race. He jump starts, a track official orders MM to pit lane, followed by MM ignoring him, riding his bike in reverse on the track, and starting from his normal grid position. Complete, utter, intentional effu to the rule book, screw off, I’m the special Spanish angel daughter of this Spanish owned series.

    On a separate note: The Race Marshall screwed Jack Miller. Jack’s is the only team who rightly chose slicks, the rest of the dopes chose grooves. The entire grid except Jack heads to the pits to change bikes, followed by Dorna delaying the race start. The entire grid except Jack starts 3 rows back. That was dead, totally wrong. IMO start the race on time, the suckers on grooved tires can pit whenever and swap bikes. If Jack sails off to the sunset and the win, so be it, his team richly rewarded for their smart and proper tire choice.

    Dorna’s policy of having a track official raise a sign reading “Rain” is beyond stupid. Of course there was no rain after that! Does some Dorna dope think the weather reads and obeys Dorna’s climate indicator signage? What is the purpose of that sign?

    Finally: Would Vinales have had more success if he stayed with Suzuki? Maybe not long term, but one might make a good argument yes up to now.

  27. Ariel says:

    The worst motorcycling racer of the history, Marc.

  28. CB says:

    Agree dman. MM has so much talent and today he just overoad a track with other people on it and messed up. Should simply apologize for passing like a JA and move on. He can’t in anyway defend his actions on any of them period. It can happen just own it bro. Last lap and corner for the championship ok… but second race pushing for whatever, it’s inexcusable.

    I know he felt a podium was possible but in reality it was not. I still dig his talent and win at all costs attitude though. Just remember you have to pass your competitors safely sir. Your responsibility coming from behind.

    • Provologna says:

      MM defended his VR46 pass, in effect claiming it was a safe and legal pass. Who agrees with MM?

      Is MM correct and he did not deserve the 30S post-race penalty for this VR46 pass, or is MM lying and he deserved that penalty and a follow up penalty for denying his obvious rule violation?

      Duh, I wonder which is correct?

      I used to hate the NFL rule which positively forbids members from any public negative reaction to rules enforced (or not) during games. Now I rethink that criticism. In effect, MM obviously and egregiously broke the rules in writing and spirit, then said “FU” to Dorna for his 30S race penalty.

      Is anyone actually down with that? If yes, bad judgement or worse.

  29. Curly says:

    The most bizarre MotoGP start ever followed by great racing by the “Other Guys” and an extreme attack of Red Mist on Marky Marc. Big fun cause nobody got hurt.

    • superlight says:

      But riders could have been hurt with Marquez’s overly aggressive riding today. He should have been disqualified and fined and/or docked season points. His obvious raw riding talent does not give him a “pass”.

      • Curly says:

        BUT none were hurt was the point. So I thoroughly enjoyed the race except for Vale and Dani going down. Marky came away with no points so there’s a bit of instant karma right there too.

        • superlight says:

          Motorcycle racing is dangerous enough without a rider literally pushing competitors out of the way. Marquez didn’t need to do that; he showed his callous disregard for others and his immaturity as a racer.

        • Dave says:

          “Marky came away with no points”

          Neither did Rossi, when he had been in 6th (10 points). It’s not enough that Marquez didn’t score points.

          • mickey says:

            They all lose points when they crash. It’s part of the game. How many points did Pedrosa lose after being punted by Zarco who ended up with 20 points?

            If you think Rossi hasn’t punted a few guys off track and out of points over the years you haven’t been following MotoGP very long. It’s been going on as long as I can remember and I started watching GP in 1973.

            As long as there has been racing, as long as there is racing, Type A personality racers on 250 horsepower motorcycles going for the same strip of pavement for money and points are going to run into each other. They try and determine the purposeful ones and penalize them, and try and determine the accidental ones and call them “racing incidents” but in each one, when someone gets knocked out of the race, they lose points.

      • Dave says:

        Re: “If you think Rossi hasn’t punted a few guys off track and out of points over the years you haven’t been following MotoGP very long.”

        I have, and I understand the “that’s racing” angle of it all. I also understand that underneath it all, it’s entertainment, and rules too rigidly enforced can drive down fan’s interest (like if Rossi hadn’t been allowed to start the final race after the kicking incident).

    • Onto says:

      “nobody got hurt”

      Sadly, Rossi did get hurt. It cost him a good handful of points.

      • Curly says:

        That’s racing. Sometimes you win sometimes you get knocked down. Vale knows that.

        • Scott says:

          Yes. But when one guy seems to be colliding with people all weekend long, and at least three times in the SAME RACE, he might just be a freaking psychopath…

          • mickey says:

            To be accurate it was twice right? Espargaro once and Rossi once.

            Or one more than Zarco this race, and the same number as Zarco last race.

            I don’t think Marquez intentionally ran into them. I honestly believe Marquez thought he could execute a tight pass. It just didn’t work out that way. Same as Zarco and Pedrosa. I think Zarco believed he could make a tight but clean pass. Just didn’t work out. These guys see small openings and go for it.Most times it works, sometimes it doesn’t and sometimes it doesn’t with bad results

  30. Nomadak says:

    Something needs to happen from race direction….and soon. It needs to be enough to get #93’s attention….in a big way. This cannot be tolerated.

    • mickey says:

      Maybe they had better talk to Zarco as well who passes in the same manner. At Qatar he bumped a couple people off line, this race he pushed Pedrosa off line who had a nasty crash and could have easily been hurt. I guess some guys are just more aggressive than others. They should be treated equally by race direction.

      Btw what happened to Lorenzo today?

      • mickey says:

        Nevermind. I see Lorenzo finished 15 th. I just never saw him during the race.

        That would make sense if my previous post wasn’t in moderation.

  31. Chris says:

    Marquez’ judgment buckled under the pressure today

  32. Joe says:

    Marquez’s attitude was reckless , and disrespectful and his approach in this race was irresponsible .
    He wasn’t just being a punk. His immense talent doesn’t entitle him to get away with disregarding competitive honor.

    • joe b says:

      Zarco did the same thing to Pedrosa, he gets a mulligan, because he rides a Yamaha like Rossi. If you look at the replay, Rossi came in from 20 feet from the inside, and rammed Marquez, who had the inside line. Rossi was reckless, arrogant, disrespectful! Marquez had a ride through penalty (like lapping Rossi, didnt Rossi see the blue flags?) But Rossi is never guilty of anything, he has fans that wear wigs and shoot off yellow smoke bombs, making him innocent of anything.

      • jimmihaffa says:

        The dry racing lines didn’t allow for passing with the efficiency and pace that Marquez needed to work his way back through the field. In response, Marquez just bowled his competitors out of the way. Simply unacceptable. This type of riding should be penalized where it hurts: 1. Directly to the violating rider’s pocketbook…and not an insignificant amount; 2. Race direction should place the rider executing an egregious pass by DQ or at least placing behind any rider that was bumped…as with horse racing infractions. Clearly, the drive through penalty doesn’t do anything in fact encourages a faster rider like Marquez to recklessly pass without consequence.

      • VLJ says:

        What race were you watching?

        Not today’s, obviously.

        Anyway, here’s a little clue for you, just in case you’re unclear on the concept. If Marc and Honda didn’t know beyond a shadow of a doubt that Marc was 100% at fault today in forcing Rossi to crash, there is literally a zero-percent chance that Alberto Puig and Marc Marquez make a beeline to Rossi’s garage immediately following the race to apologize to him in full view of all the assembled media.

        Marc and Honda knew how badly he stepped in it today. That little sojourn over to Rossi’s garage was strictly an attempt to minimize the damage and save face. If there is any chance whatsoever that they feel Marc wasn’t solely at fault, there is no way Red Ass Extraordinaire Alberto Puig makes that hateful walk to the Yamaha garage.

        It was all about the optics. It was a necessary PR move, when Marc left them with no other option.

      • Curly says:

        MM was overtaking and behind so had the responsabilty of making the pass safely and Rossi had the line which was nothing like 20 feet off the corner.

      • Scott says:

        You forgot to use the sarcasm emoji, but nice one! That was epic…

      • Glen Corsello says:

        M93 was wrong yesterday. He knows it, we know it, the Officials know it. The whole world knows it.

  33. mickey says:

    What a crazy crazy race, I’m still trying to understand everything I saw and everything that happened. A lot to absorb lol.

    Good night Marquez was fast but he wasted it with stupid penalties. bet this race makes his relationship with Rossi better…NOT!

    Special congrats to Rins for putting the Suzuki on the podium.

    • superlight says:

      The penalties were not stupid, but Marquez’s riding was.

      • mickey says:

        I’m not saying the penalties weren’t deserved, I am saying he didn’t need to do the things he did, which earned him those penalties.

        It’s only the second race of the season, plenty of races left to make up lost points. A more mature descision would have been to settle for whatever points you could get without doing stupid stuff.

  34. dt 175 says:

    good to see smoke coming from the Suzuki’s tire rather than the exhaust. marquez is the patron saint of Squid…

  35. dman says:

    MM93 should have gotten at least a 40 second penalty to put him behind Rossi in the results. Marc was riding like a Superman, losing a few seconds to make safer passes wouldn’t have changed that. He really screwed up in my opinion.

    • Fred M. says:

      Rossi should have been given an adjustment to keep him in 6th at the end of the race. He earned that position and the points with his riding and he should not have been denied that because of Marquez blatant disregard for safety.